Update on fake PCGS holders with a CC twist

Some people here may know who Logan McKechnie is, he is a Morgan Dollar dealer, an attorney by trade and a frequent contributor to Vamworld. He posted a story about a possible fake 1879-CC in a fake PCGS holder and I will just copy it verbatim. He can explain it better than I.

"Just got a call from a very good dealer who was seeking a fair price to offer a customer in his shop on a 1879 CC in a PCGS MS-63 holder. The reason for the call: the coin was a Reverse of 1878. A quick call to John Roberts resulted in an agreement that even a TPG service couldn't make that mistake and John's suggestion that a magnet be put up to the slab. My dealer friend tried to buy the coin at a reasonable price and could not. [Second converstation: story from the seller was that he had won this coin and several others (1883-S, 1884-S, 1892-S, etc.] in a poker game.] It's scary out there folks."

Then another gentleman who recently got a job as a grader at NGC summarized a post from the PCGS forum:

"now, heres a REAL bad problem that was brought up on the PCGS forums:
Whats stopping someone from sending in one of these high quality fakes (the recent 89 CC's are very good) and getting a reholder? Does PCGS even look at the coin for a reholder? Thats the question."


My question is, has anyone checked the certification number on a fake PCGS holder? If a person was to put together a fake PCGS holder for a fake VF '89-CC, he could duplicate the certification number from a real '89-CC. Then if PCGS merely checked the certification number when they reholdered, that control would be compromised. On the other hand, you would think PCGS, or NGC could identify a fake holder on sight. What do you think, Rusty?

They fake slabs seem to often have a correct serial number. I have seen before where a fake slab checks out ok on the PCGS site then someone has found the correct and real PCGS coin in the heritage archives. The coins then look very different when compared.

As far as the reholder that is a good and scary question. PCGS has a very large sample of fakes I have seen at shows before. We can only hope they check reholders for fakes as they do when grading. No idea on their process for that.

I posed a question on vamworld to the person who is a grader at NGC asking what NGC does when reholdering coins. He hasn't responded, but there are a dozen posts after mine so he may not see it.

Todd,

I would personally be willing to pay a little extra for grading to PCGS or NGC for coins valued over "X price" if they would add some kind of special lazer image or other anti-counterfitting device. There is a lot at stake here and it would be worth the added cost to protect our numimatic treasures.

B

I haven't seen a counterfeit slab up close. I imagine the hologram on the reverse was supposed to be such a device. I dont know if the bad guys have successfully duplicated that. Anyone know?